sleigh: (Default)
([personal profile] sleigh Sep. 14th, 2008 12:43 pm)
...only peripherally political.

I was musing on this after watching the news. To me, "fair and balanced reporting" is to look at what is said and done, ascertain the facts, and put those facts out there with as little spin as possible (some spin, yes, is inevitable, just by the choice of words). Fair and balanced reporting is saying, without hedging, that "You, sir or madam, said X, but that's contradicted by This and That fact, which indicate that Y is actually the case. How do you answer that?" The relationship between the press and the government is supposed to be adversarial: the press is supposed to be the watchdog that keeps people from abusing power and calls them on their spin, their lies, and their inconsistencies.

That's not what I see on any of the main news channels. Instead, now what passes for "fair and balanced reporting" is noting that This Person Said (or Did) That, then having two talking heads, once from either side, contradict each other and give a full-spin account based on their agendas. There's no fact-checking, there's no dialog, there's no calling of someone for giving flat-out misinformation.

And it's all I ever see on CNN or MSNBC or ABC, NBC, and CBS.

You're not 'reporting' if you're just allowing the two sides to give their account of the situation without commentary or input. You're reporting if you dig for the facts, give those facts to the people, and let them draw their own conclusions. You're reporting if when someone says "I did X" you stop them in the middle of their pre-fabricated sound bite and say, "No, that's not true. Actually, you did Y, and here's where I found that information."

So where is that kind of reporting? Did it ever exist? It's certainly not on the cable/broadcast 'news.' There are scraps of it on the internet (factcheck.org comes to mind for at least trying to determine the truth of political claims), but mostly, it seems to be missing.

I want my adversarial media back. Where are the Brits when you need them?

From: [identity profile] barondave.livejournal.com


I've tried to do some of that, but I wasn't doing investigatorial journalism. Mostly, I was channeling Herodotus: "I don't necessarily believe what they say, but this is what they told me." I'm working on editing more interviews from the RNC, which will appear on my LJ.

In the meantime, I had a lot of fun talking to foreign reporters (http://barondave.livejournal.com/182502.html), with another one coming up.

You're right, though. "Journalism" has become a sad affair. I blame Watergate... but that's a long story.

From: [identity profile] barondave.livejournal.com


Uncovering Watergate, and the related scandals of the Nixon administration, took several years of investigative journalism. Hard work, knocking on doors, wearing out shoe leather.

Then the story broke, a president suddenly resigned. A big deal. All the hard work forgotten for the payoff which made Woodward and Bernstein famous. Now, all reporters want Robert Redford to play them in the movie.

From: [identity profile] sleigh.livejournal.com


:-) (And how does one "wave Britishly"? Do you have to do that closed-fingers "Queen wave"?

From: [identity profile] desperance.livejournal.com


Yup. It's inbuilt; comes from the stiff upper lip, which necessarily has implications all through the musculature.

From: [identity profile] daedala.livejournal.com


Here's a neat article someone linked to. You may have already seen it: http://www.edge.org/3rd_culture/haidt08/haidt08_index.html

From: [identity profile] casaubon.livejournal.com

A British viewpoint


Adversarial interviews don't really work very well, because politicians are extremely good at evasion, answering another question, or simply barging on regardless. It occasionally makes for good TV/radio but it rarely gets at the truth.
An adversarial stance in general news pieces is another matter. The BBC regularly gets accused of being biased in both directions, which I think is a good sign. It's often viewed as fairly left wing, but several of its reporters have gone on to be Tory MPs, so that's not true in all cases.

From: [identity profile] maiac.livejournal.com


We don't get fair and balanced reporting. We get "fair and balanced" reporting. Remember, "Fair and Balanced" was the motto Fox News gave itself; the phrase is disingenuous and ironic.

I remember reading quotations from members to the effect that it's not their job to tell us what's true. It's only their job to tell us what both sides said, and it's up to their audience (us) to figure out for ourselves, strictly from what each side is saying, whether somebody's lying.

Which is not the definition of journalism that I learned in college, let me tell you.

At least some members of the media have decided that it is their job, after all, to tell us whether something is true or false. I've seen quite a few stories in recent days contrasting what Sarah Palin is saying (and what McCain and others are saying on her behalf) with her actual record. If only they'd bothered to do that with what the Republicans said about Al Gore in 2000, and what George W. Bush said about himself.

From: [identity profile] greenmtnboy18.livejournal.com


I believe it did exist at some point, because I remember it too. Vaguely.

What drives me crazy about the two talking heads representing "either side" model, is that they just sit there and try to talk OVER each other, and say REALLY STUPID THINGS. (but as you noted, are not called on that by the news person) Stupid things like completely discounting false information without addressing the meat of it or how it got out there in the first place, and just trying to shout louder when the "other side" pushes on the issue. I've been forced into overhearing CNN at the gym a number of times recently, and over and over it's two people trying to literally SHOUT over the other person, to the point where I start completely losing what either is saying.

To say nothing of the idiocy I watched down south when I was there in August, when they were covering Obama's potential running mate. Again with the strange passiveness of the reporter, and the really irritating approach of two opposing people yelling at each other.

It makes my skin crawl.

From: [identity profile] barbarienne.livejournal.com


It is sad that the best news program in the US is The Daily Show. On the other hand, it shows that adversarial interviewing makes for great entertainment.

I can only imagine that the networks aren't following suit because they'll get the same reaction: pols will be afraid to go on. That's what makes The Colbert Report work: enough conservatives don't realize it's making fun of them that they get sucked into the trap.

From: [identity profile] spaceoperadiva.livejournal.com


Give Me My Father's Body (http://www.amazon.com/Give-Me-My-Fathers-Body/dp/074341005X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1221448134&sr=8-1) The Life of Minik the New York Eskimo by Ken Harper, while not a book focusing on journalism, reveals a lot about how the press worked at the turn of the last century. Journalistic integrity has been an iffy proposition pretty much since Herodotus, as [livejournal.com profile] barondave points out. There was a big push in the 1960's and 70's for ethical journalism but it never seems to be a long-lasting trend. The average news consumer seems to be interested in sensational fluff, not fair and/or reasonable coverage of anything. Thus the state of Lindsey Lohan's undies trumps the state of the Asian financial market.

From: [identity profile] lindajdunn.livejournal.com

Will New Zealand do?


http://www.scoop.co.nz/stories/HL0809/S00170.htm

I found more details on Troopergate in that publication than I've been able to find in any of the US sites. It feels like the US sites just say the same old blurbs over and over and then spin it. This has an interview and the link back took me to a pdf file with the FULL transcript of the phone conversation that was taped between the governor's aid, Bailey, and one of the people he was pressuring.

More, there's a note there that under questioning, he revealed that he got the questionable, privileged information from Todd Palin.

So THIS is why they're issuing a supeona for the first dude!

Interesting.

From: [identity profile] ysabetwordsmith.livejournal.com

Thoughts


I don't accept that the media must be adversarial to the government (or anyone else) because that presupposes that 1) the government will always behave so badly that it deserves to be attacked routinely, and 2) even if it didn't, the media would do so anyhow. I don't trust the government in general, but I want to hold out a thread of hope that someday we may figure out how to do it right. And if we do, the media should celebrate that, not harass it to death. Sometimes they ignore things they should not ignore, because they are not paid to report facts, they are paid to attract viewers by any means necessary. That includes some extremely vile attacks on some people who are actually doing something right. For the most part, though, I agree with you that they're not being careful about fact-checking or diligent about muck-raking. The media are screwing up in many directions at once.

I've got one sharpish essay about the state of journalism here:
http://ysabetwordsmith.livejournal.com/207127.html

From: [identity profile] chasophonic.livejournal.com


"The relationship between the press and the government is supposed to be adversarial: the press is supposed to be the watchdog that keeps people from abusing power and calls them on their spin, their lies, and their inconsistencies."

When I read "A Team Of Rivals", I was surprised that in the political world as Lincoln came to power, newspapers where openly organs of parties and other political or social groups.

From: [identity profile] mrcleanhead.livejournal.com


For the love of all that's holy, Stephen! I was in an all day quarterly-goal-setting meeting today, and during one of the breaks, I checked CNN. As I was reading it, I cried out loud to the baffled looks of my fellow meeters (not joking), "Why the f.." I was flummoxed in that to get the real news, I have to read something like www.factcheck.org

What the crickey?! It's like the search for truth is irrelevant! I hate hate that McCain/Palin can flat out lie, and instead of the media checking the facts and reporting, "Palin's a big fat pants on fire liar", they just report everything she says like it's reality.

What the f...

From: [identity profile] sleigh.livejournal.com


Exactly. Someone flat-out lies, and the reaction is to get one Republican and one Democrat on the air, one to agree with the statement and the other to disagree, but never actually say "Whoa! That's a big fat one, and here are the facts of the matter."

It's a disgrace.
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